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Age of Empires III Heaven » Forums » General Discussions » A Second X-pack? How could it be possible?
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Topic Subject:A Second X-pack? How could it be possible?
Novoa20
Skirmisher
posted 03-17-06 08:51 PM EDT (US)         

Quoted from Sandy:

2) Is there a possibility of there being more than one X-pac?

A. I think it is exceedingly unlikely. Here is why. As things stand, people who play the X-Pack won't be able to play against people who just have the standard game (there are way too many changes). So ESO will have to be divided into two parts: X-Pack and Vanilla. That is not really much of a problem. But if we add a Y-Pack we'd have to divide ESO up into 4 segments: Standard; X-Pack; Y-Pack; and X+Y Pack. Plus we have the issue of trying to make sure that the Y-Pack both stands alone and with the X-Pack. One possible way to address this would be to require you to own the X-Pack to play the Y-pack, but then this makes the potential audience much smaller, making it less worth doing. You see the problems I'm sure. Anyway, that's my opinion.

To begin with, this isn't a "whiny" topic that is about how terrible the X-pack that's coming out is and how good an Asian/Africa colonization theme would have been so cool.

Here Sandy states the reasons why a second X-pack wouldn't be possible.

I have made this topic in hopes that suddenly one of us becomes an Einstein and develop a smart solution for this problem. That is, depending that you actually want a second X-pack.

Particularly, I think it is possible, and that the only thing hindering such a thing from happening is ESO.

***********************************************************

I am really interested in hearing your ideas, and don't feel intimidated if anybody says anything to you like "your idea is idiotic." The more ideas, the more we might get close to figuring out a way to make a second x-pack work.

***********************************************************

It is fine to do discussion on each others ideas, just as long as they are constructive.

This is not meant to discuss ideas on civilizations or natives, this is just meant to find a way in which a second X-pack will work.

%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%

Use this basis when talking about X-packs:

1.Vanilla = Original, or just simply say original, vanilla just sound tastier.

2. X = First X-pack, or you can call it chocolate.

3. Y = Second X-pack, or you can call it Strawberry.

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Ok, so, here's my plan:

ES gets 2 ESO rooms for vanilla and chocolate. When strawberry comes, let it set for a while and advice players to get the second X-pack and do a poll every 2 or 3 weeks to check who has already bought the X-pack.

Once the answers to the poll reach higher than...ummm...let's say 85%, give a one-month or two-month notice that X and Y packs are getting combined.

Then bam! There's still 2 ESO rooms.

Here's my second plan:

Ok, so there's 2 ESO rooms. When strawberry comes out, make another ESO room for it. After a while, make a poll to find out how many have both X-packs, and if majority is reached, then mix both of them and thus return to 2 ESO rooms.

-----------------------------------------------------------

(I know my plans aren't the brightest, but they're plans after all.)

So, what are your ideas on this?

AuthorReplies:
AFF92
Skirmisher
posted 03-17-06 10:08 PM EDT (US)     1 / 21       
I can get 3 free ones online, buddy!
Smertios
Skirmisher
posted 03-18-06 06:53 AM EDT (US)     2 / 21       
Well, if it's too difficult to make three multiplayer types of game. The Y-pack wouldn't have this option...
Lone Rex
Skirmisher
posted 03-18-06 07:46 AM EDT (US)     3 / 21       
That would be cool.

Like in 2nd x-pack they could add Asian and African Rms.

Kinda like combine the X-packs on the way, just like u said, sounds original but interesting.


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[This message has been edited by Lone Rex (edited 03-18-2006 @ 07:47 AM).]

Novoa20
Skirmisher
posted 03-18-06 08:34 AM EDT (US)     4 / 21       
I have several games that have more than one X-pack.

These games have a lot of regulators, and by no surprise these are very popular games.

They aren't war games like AoE, though. Still, it proves that a game is capable of being successful even after 2 X-packs.

In fact, the games I have, as a minimum, contain about 3 X-packs and as a maximum 6.

jd10013
Skirmisher
posted 03-18-06 09:35 AM EDT (US)     5 / 21       
well, i guess sandy never did say it was impossible, just unlikely. he said something about the age x-packs only have about 35% of the sales of the original, and a second xpack would likely get only 35% of the sales that the first x-pack got. So, the sales wouldn't justify the investment. Or if you wanted to look at it the other way, the tiny amount of time and money tht could be put into a second x-pack and still turn a proffit wouldn't allow them to do much.
Joeking14
Skirmisher
posted 03-18-06 10:24 AM EDT (US)     6 / 21       
Wouldn't it be more like 35% of gamers who own AOE 3 would get x-pack Y and another 35% get x-pack Z.

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jd10013
Skirmisher
posted 03-18-06 11:19 AM EDT (US)     7 / 21       
sandy seemed to think x-pack 2 would only get 35% of the sales of x-pack 1
Joeking14
Skirmisher
posted 03-18-06 11:37 AM EDT (US)     8 / 21       
I know but some people might not get X-pack Y but still get X-pack Z and some might get both.

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Kumar Shah
Skirmisher
posted 03-18-06 01:26 PM EDT (US)     9 / 21       
There isn't going to be a second X-pack.

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BilboBeutlin
Skirmisher
posted 03-18-06 03:51 PM EDT (US)     10 / 21       
I don't know, why the guys @ ES make things more difficult as they are ..

Even in the same room it is possible to play with different versions. The host determines the game setup as usual. Additionally would displayed the game configuration, like "Basic" or "AddOn1 + AddOn2". Only players whose config. matches would be able to participate on the same game.

Another point is the game evaluation. But imo there is no need to divide ranking/ladder into different categories.

Incompatibility as rationale for no further addons is a lame excuse. Why not just honestly admitting: commercial reasons ..

Natus
Skirmisher
posted 03-18-06 04:33 PM EDT (US)     11 / 21       
Novoa20,

trying to be constructive here, but a second x-pac is a pipe dream. You'd spend your time a lot better thinking up a cool mod or a cure for cancer. I don't see why the modding teams aren't designing the crap out of all the civs we'll miss.

The ONLY wasy it would be possible would be $$$. And the only way that will happen is if the x-pac outsells the original AoE3. I know; it doesn't make any sense. But that's what it comes down to. And the x-pac will never sell as much as the original, not by a long shot.

How I wish I were wrong!

Novoa20
Skirmisher
posted 03-18-06 05:21 PM EDT (US)     12 / 21       
I find Sandy's estimation on how many would buy a little stretched.

In reality, I am not what you could call a "true" fan, but I would certainly always have a good look at Age of Empires games(and other games of that type)for some of them prove to be pretty good(Others aren't).

I would also(Considering how AoE3 is comming along with gameplay)very likely buy another X-pack for the game if it dealt with African/Asian colonization.


Considering the good history AoE has had, I seriously doubt that 35% of the buyers are going to buy the second X-pack. In fact I actually think that more than half of the gamers would buy the X-pack.

Sure, it won't be at 75% to 100%, but it will definately not be lower than 50%.


I am also aware of the fact of how the cost of how much it would take ES to produce an second X-pack, but I am looking at it in mostly a buyers perspective.

Personally, before I went and talked about probabilities(Which are usually good guesses, but not very accurate), I would take a simple poll on all of those who have bought the game and simply ask who would buy a second X-pack. Out of that, then I think finally the real statistics are going to come out, and from that then I think the decission could come.

A poll is never going to harm. It would actually help to clarify facts(To get a 100% check that there is definately no chance there is going to be another X-pack).

Thank you for your reponses so far though.

[This message has been edited by Novoa20 (edited 03-18-2006 @ 05:23 PM).]

CrazyMrLeo
Skirmisher
posted 03-18-06 06:03 PM EDT (US)     13 / 21       
Civ III solved the X, Y, X+Y problem by including X free with purchase of Y. That way, nobody had Y only.

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DarkShaman
Skirmisher
(id: ChickenBoy)
posted 03-18-06 10:54 PM EDT (US)     14 / 21       
But what if you already had x-pack? Would you have to buy it all over again to get what is in y-pack?

Besides, ESO would still be Basic/X/Y- you could still have only the first expantion.


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Novoa20
Skirmisher
posted 03-19-06 00:28 AM EDT (US)     15 / 21       
What Leo is trying to say is that for those who haven't bought the X-pack, having both X-packs in one would be a nice way to promote the buying of the Y-pack.

For those who already have X-pack, they could also realese the single version of the Y-pack.

To also promote the Y-pack, perhaps ES could add some more extra stuff with the buying such as drawings(Which most people like)or collectibles such as a little toy(People like war toys, wether old or young).

Of course, the promotants shouldn't cost a lot either for it would be idiotic to be paying the Y-pack mainly for the extra-merchandise.

Drinian
Savage Norseman
(id: TimmySpok)
posted 03-19-06 07:07 AM EDT (US)     16 / 21       
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jd10013
Skirmisher
posted 03-19-06 09:13 AM EDT (US)     17 / 21       

Quote:

Considering the good history AoE has had, I seriously doubt that 35% of the buyers are going to buy the second X-pack. In fact I actually think that more than half of the gamers would buy the X-pack.

i'm guessing he's bassing that on previous experience with age games and x-packs. although 35% of AOEIII would be about 500,000 units. and thats current sales.


Quote:

Personally, before I went and talked about probabilities(Which are usually good guesses, but not very accurate), I would take a simple poll on all of those who have bought the game and simply ask who would buy a second X-pack. Out of that, then I think finally the real statistics are going to come out, and from that then I think the decission could come.

i'm sure microsoft has marketing people who do just that. polls, focus groups ect.

i think one of the big factors is, unlike other developers who want to milk as much as possible from a game, ES is more eager to start on a new one.


[This message has been edited by jd10013 (edited 03-19-2006 @ 09:15 AM).]

Natus
Skirmisher
posted 03-19-06 01:55 PM EDT (US)     18 / 21       

Quote:

I find Sandy's estimation on how many would buy a little stretched.

Considering the good history AoE has had, I seriously doubt that 35% of the buyers are going to buy the second X-pack. In fact I actually think that more than half of the gamers would buy the X-pack.

Sure, it won't be at 75% to 100%, but it will definately not be lower than 50%.

Now, why do you go and do this? People were taking you seriously. You're asking them not to.

You know better than Sandy???? You can speak with such assurance about what will happen in six months to a year? Just because you want something badly, and can think of all kinds of reasons for your case, doesn't mean it will happen. Why don't you listen to the ES man instead of disputing it like you're in the know? Are you in the PC game business? I bet not. So let's stick to the fairy tale aspect of this thread (the what if?), rather than making yourself look ridiculous by saying "I seriously doubt" and "definitely." You don't know. And, for now, Papa Sandy does. Listen to him.

[This message has been edited by Natus (edited 03-19-2006 @ 01:56 PM).]

Cancer of the Head
Skirmisher
(id: say1988)
posted 03-19-06 02:21 PM EDT (US)     19 / 21       
Also you can look at it this way, as long as they make x-packs for AoE3 they probably wont make AoE4.

I do agree, I can't see why they can't have 1 room and specify games used for the game, but the people at ES probably know more about this than all of us combined.

Also with the consideration of the number of sales, in another year there will be more games out that draw more people away from AoE3, which lessens the total number of potential customers.

You talk about other games having a number of expansion packs, many of those games are not supported online by the makers, just idependant servers, or in some cases the x-pack and not x-pack can play together or other things.

[This message has been edited by say1988 (edited 03-19-2006 @ 02:27 PM).]

Novoa20
Skirmisher
posted 03-19-06 09:31 PM EDT (US)     20 / 21       

Quoted from Natus:

You know better than Sandy???? You can speak with such assurance about what will happen in six months to a year?

I clearly stated on my opinion the word I think. It is clear I am not an expert at this(Whoever takes me 100% serirously really must have problems), but my guess is a guess just like Sandy's(Even though his is much better supported).

Quoted from Natus:

rather than making yourself look ridiculous by saying "I seriously doubt" and "definitely."

I'm not the one making myself look ridiculous by misunderstanding other people's messages.

Sady even said:

Quoted from ES_Sandy:

I think it is exceedingly unlikely. Here is why...

The word THINK takes out the 100% reality on the statement. My statement and Sandy's aren't 100%.

He bases his in past history, and I base mine on what I think. Making his more close, but nevetheless still innacurate.

Quoted from Say1988:

Also with the consideration of the number of sales, in another year there will be more games out that draw more people away from AoE3, which lessens the total number of potential customers.

That's why there should be promoters.

There's a few number of people who actually like to play these type of games. AoE is a favorite in this type of franchise. When AoE3 came out, it was bought by a lot of people, but then these people sold the game at cheaper prizes because they found it "boring." Those who didn't sell theirs are people who actually liked the game, and will most likely buy X-packs for the game if they include what is wanted and a little bit more(Africa/Asia colonization, some promoters).

lachlan
Skirmisher
posted 03-20-06 08:05 AM EDT (US)     21 / 21       
Ahem 'Sandy' is trying to sell you on why there won't be a second X-pack. Probably because the team wants to work on something else and is disinclined to work on something with a lower profit margin. Ergo, he's probably trotting out a rather conservative estimate of sales.

I would like to see a second expansion of civs and maps only with no major gameplay adjustments but it seems highly unlikely.

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