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Age of Empires III Heaven » Forums » General Discussions » do india really need a boost?
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Topic Subject:do india really need a boost?
mm8mm8
Skirmisher
posted 02-10-08 01:44 PM EDT (US)         
there fine imo
because they can rush quickly and do a ff with elephants
and i really think there not so slow because they have a free villagers with each shipment
AuthorReplies:
Vivacious
Skirmisher
posted 02-10-08 02:16 PM EDT (US)     1 / 12       
The 8% XP penalty pretty much makes their getting a "free" villager moot.

Otherwise, I think they're fine, though Gurkha desperately need an increase in their modifier for late game.
steve09
Skirmisher
posted 02-10-08 03:37 PM EDT (US)     2 / 12       
yeah i think a slight boost to gurka would make them fine because their sepoy rush is pretty potent atm

quoted from jafit talking smack about ender in regards to the abus nerf: "He's probably in a fetal position on the floor holding an action figure abus gun."
TheTaiPan
Skirmisher
posted 02-10-08 03:37 PM EDT (US)     3 / 12       
i think something like this would be fair:

gurkha need a boot,
howda-damage nerf,
shipments little faster
schildpad
Skirmisher
posted 02-10-08 05:23 PM EDT (US)     4 / 12       
Why nerf something that isnt OP (howdah)?

Why are there settlers more expensive than french settler, but dont got all the advantages french settler have

Why dont they get a wood gather bonus, instead of receiving first 2 market upgrades

Why are mahouts basicly cuirs with -50% attack, and +2x *LI? (making them 2 times worse to almost all units). Not to mention, why do they have 0.5x settler?

Why do siege elephants have more tags than population cost? Culvs do bonus damage vs them, goons do, skirmishers do, and they have low ranged resistance + low range. Meaning in practise skirms take them out before they can do significant damage.

Why dont they have a counter to late game ranged HI?

Why does brittish thing upgrade card for infantry suck?

Why do sowar suck compared to other melee cav?

Why do they only start with 5 settler?

Why does it take an agra fort 8 shots to kill an envoy?


Many questions...

You just need to make sure when boosting them, that the sepoy rush wont become too strong.

"such a kind fellow!" ~ ķįŋğ_Ćħŗĩ_ĬĬ

Furby killer should be crowned leader of AOE forum ~ [SW_GD]Teutonic

DLKels
Skirmisher
posted 02-10-08 06:57 PM EDT (US)     5 / 12       
So what.

You can post a list about the shortcomings of every civ, they all have them and they all should have at least some of them. They can be overcome with their strengths, except the ports. HA!

I play India and the Portuguese.

India is far more balanced than the ports. I was in favor of removing the exp penalty and improving gurkhas before. Now I'm just in favor of a small boost to gurkhas. Everything else is fine.

And whoever said nerf howdahs, are you nuts?
lachlan
Skirmisher
posted 02-10-08 08:29 PM EDT (US)     6 / 12       
India has one Ele that doesn't totally suck and you want to nerf that?
ultimitsu
Skirmisher
posted 02-10-08 09:05 PM EDT (US)     7 / 12       
after playing against some very good indian players, i dont think india need a boost.

1, gurka - no CIR, but same over all effectiveness as skirm yet cheaper, 90% most game end before CIR is required.

2, elephants - they are actually a lot better than I initially thought, because they simply dont die if microed well, mohaout is copnsiderably better than cuirs in fortress. i have no trouble beating 2 cuirs with 20 skirms, but i lose them every time against 1 mahout. howdah is basically a merc version of ww, twice the ranged HP and over twice the damage. they die to melee faster, but who ever got to melee them anyway? siege elephant is a culvrin + mortar combo, only they last well against melee units and moves like cavalry.

3, the eco - everyone thought indian's eco was very slow, well 4 month has gone past and most indian players have figured out that you dont need goo eco to win if: 1, you have stronger units, 2, you have better shipment, 3, you have eco boost with the shipments, 4, your can gather treasure very well to compensate for the xp penalty.

if 8% shipment penalty is to be removed (which i think is only fair - to give them more flexiblity), then there need to be some form of nerf, either to agra fort or elephant shipments.
schildpad
Skirmisher
posted 02-11-08 01:49 AM EDT (US)     8 / 12       
So then india still cant counter HI late game. And i didnt even think you could nerf agra fort? Change attack to 1 with ROF of 10 secs?

"such a kind fellow!" ~ ķįŋğ_Ćħŗĩ_ĬĬ

Furby killer should be crowned leader of AOE forum ~ [SW_GD]Teutonic

ultimitsu
Skirmisher
posted 02-11-08 01:57 AM EDT (US)     9 / 12       
of course india has HI counter late game - A, Sepoy, B, Gurka.

they both have the Mansabdar unit which gives a decent boost, very hard to identify in massed battles to focus fire, once killed can be bought again rather cheaply.

on top of that you got inspiration power to use for battles. late game india definitely dont lose to HI.

hwoever, that is not to say i am against giving Gurka CIR with Honored upgrade, or maybe Exalt upgrade.
exc4libulz1022
Skirmisher
posted 02-11-08 02:08 AM EDT (US)     10 / 12       
The 8% XP penalty pretty much makes their getting a "free" villager moot.
Yeah, it's a lot like germany was when they were UP, I'm actually somewhat surprised that ES went ahead and made EXACTLY the same mistake again.

Schildpad that was an amusing post

And yeah, I agree that if the shipment penalty was entirely removed in addition to a CIR upgrade, there would probaly have to be some kind of compensating nerf. Not agra fort though, the only way you could nerf that crap is by giving it the attack of a villager :P

"he will have a hard getting banks up"
~rel4xed

"I accidently drop kicked someone once"
~george_uk

[This message has been edited by exc4libulz1022 (edited 02-11-2008 @ 02:10 AM).]

ultimitsu
Skirmisher
posted 02-11-08 02:48 AM EDT (US)     11 / 12       
AGRA FORT is very powerful, i dont knwo why you guys dont realise this, all good player use it colonial war, or FF against rushing civ.

it does 25 siege damage so more powerful against LI and cavalry than outpost, has twice the HP, and act as a barrack.

my idea of a nerf would be remove the 2 sepoy bonus for colonial.
schildpad
Skirmisher
posted 02-11-08 04:44 AM EDT (US)     12 / 12       
Wait ulti, this is a joke, right? You want to use sepoy to counter late game HI spam? True, it is the only thing india can do, but i wouldnt call 'spamming more units yourself' a counter. And mansabdar helps, but that is being compensated by really sucky upgrade cards for ranged infantry.

And ghurkas countering musks late game? Make my day and check the stats late game. I have seen it several times: Enemy musks have more then twice the attack of my ghurkas and twice the HP. The attack is mostly compensated by the 2x multiplier against HI, but it doesnt come anywhere near compensating the HP difference with its resistance.
Not having CIR + not having unit upgrade cards hurts again.

And inspiration power isnt something i would worry about as opponent. The recharge time should be much shorter.

Finally: I dont know which game you play and/or what you have been smoking, but in the game i play a outpost does far more damage to cav and LI than an agra fort:
Outpost does 45 attack vs them, not including ranged resist of them, agra fort does 25. And their ranged resist isnt going to compensate for such a difference in attack.

(if you meant *LI, then yes agra fort does more damage, but it is really small difference. And even if outpost wouldnt have more attack, then still you got a 'fort' that has same attack as outpost and is stronger. How usefull is the attack of 1 outpost?)

"such a kind fellow!" ~ ķįŋğ_Ćħŗĩ_ĬĬ

Furby killer should be crowned leader of AOE forum ~ [SW_GD]Teutonic

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