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Age of Empires III Heaven » Forums » General Discussions » Does the AI learn? (and rants)
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Topic Subject:Does the AI learn? (and rants)
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pinter
Banned
posted 09-18-05 00:56 AM EDT (US)         
Firstly I want to congratulate ES on the wonderful game. Incredibly fun

I am not sure if it is just my imagination but it seems like the AI is capable of learning how I play. (wow.) Evidence being I can no longer ever defeat the Expert AI on Texas. I bet it first 3 times but now it seems like it learnt all it's mistakes and now continues to crush me with ease. Arr!

Anyone else experience something similar?

(playing on big map mod)

Might as well keep on ranting- I am sure this has been addressed but longbows are very good. Too good(?) I feel, Lancers do work against them somewhat but massed longbows...Yikes! Reminds one of massed Elite longbows in Aok!

Do people build those other cannons? Only cannon I build is the Field Gun, it is pretty much capable of everything the other cannons specialize in. My humble suggestion here is to make the other cannons bit cheaper: say 300 gold instead of 400.

In the demo the manor house do not give me extra villagers. I assume that's just a demo-bug right?

I read here how people think natives are too underpowered- or overpowered: I personally think they are just right. They don't cost any gold and they are not too overpowering. Natives should never form a core of an army anyway...I find the flavour they add to the game to be great. Good move by ES I think.

I must say I miss formations greatly. If bonousing formations is bit too hard to balance just the practical formations from AoK I would welcome alot...although I heard someplace they are not coming back...oh well not too much of a loss.

Did anyone read that? Once again, yay for a great game. Demo itself seems to be very entertaining!

[This message has been edited by pinter (edited 09-18-2005 @ 01:37 AM).]

AuthorReplies:
Byzantine2793
Skirmisher
posted 09-18-05 00:58 AM EDT (US)     1 / 29       
yea i think so though it hasnt learned with the fort, it seems to knoiw exactly what ill do and p[lan ahead, if i biuild a stable it builds pikes, if i build a braks it builds longbows

the ai is a computer chip therticly a computer chip with volitile data likle it, could ajust tpo its surroundings and act, well, real

[This message has been edited by Byzantine2793 (edited 09-18-2005 @ 00:59 AM).]

pinter
Banned
posted 09-18-05 01:07 AM EDT (US)     2 / 29       
what the hell is wrong with your keyboard?
Byzantine2793
Skirmisher
posted 09-18-05 01:13 AM EDT (US)     3 / 29       
me typing to fast
Mokon
Skirmisher
posted 09-18-05 01:20 AM EDT (US)     4 / 29       
the computer does learn. it stores old games ina while

Mokon | | | AoE3 Rate 2200~ | | |
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  • petard_rusher
    Skirmisher
    posted 09-18-05 01:26 AM EDT (US)     5 / 29       
    it doesnt use that information for anything in the demo though, so it isn't really learning anything.

    [This message has been edited by petard_rusher (edited 09-18-2005 @ 02:00 AM).]

    john360
    Skirmisher
    posted 09-18-05 01:30 AM EDT (US)     6 / 29       
    The AI learns?As in...improves and learns your strategies to counter them?sweet!!!

    AAAAAAAH the bad spellers and the fast typers are posting...run for cover!

    pinter
    Banned
    posted 09-18-05 01:36 AM EDT (US)     7 / 29       
    http://www.spellcheck.net/

    Seriously.

    btw do you folks use other cannons?

    [This message has been edited by pinter (edited 09-18-2005 @ 01:38 AM).]

    Doggiedoodle
    Skirmisher
    posted 09-18-05 01:41 AM EDT (US)     8 / 29       
    I almost never use the normal cannons. The way I see it, it makes more sense to use the gold for the 3 cannons to get to age four instead so i can produce heavy cannons or rockets from the factory since they're more powerful and mostly free. The production rate is a bit slow though so i doubt it would work as well online. Its probably best to gold horde and produce those falconets and culverins. The mortars seem a bit pointless though.

    [This message has been edited by Doggiedoodle (edited 09-18-2005 @ 01:42 AM).]

    Timeless_OmO
    Skirmisher
    posted 09-18-05 02:15 AM EDT (US)     9 / 29       
    Yea, I can't say for sure, but I switched to playing Spanish recently and the first game, I didn't even rush the ai and crushed it easily. The next game, however, was much harder, doing nearly the same move. I've noticed that the Spanish AI plays much better, too, for some reason - probably the faster experience and access to more cards. The British AI just booms and sits around until age 3 or so, whereas the Spanish AI likes to constantly raid my workers.

    As far as the ai building appropriate units to counter yours even without scouting, this is probably a "cheat" like in IC where the AI can see everything and knows what you are building and responds accordingly.

    It would be nice to get an official response on the demo ai, because I could swear that sometimes it does seem to be "learning". If not, then I really can't wait to see this in game...

    falcdragon
    Skirmisher
    posted 09-18-05 03:14 AM EDT (US)     10 / 29       
    I'm also thinking the AI may be "learning abit". First few times I took on the expert AI it would pretty much only build Cannons and Lancers, but recently it seems to have been producing greater numbers of pikes and including them in all its attacks.

    "Till shade is gone, till water is gone, into the Shadow with teeth bared, screaming defiance with the last breath to spit in Sightblinders's eye on the Last Day." WOT Aiel saying
    Tactics:- the art of disposing armed forces in contact with the enemy.
    Strategy:- The art of war. The management of Nations or Army's in war.
    pinter
    Banned
    posted 09-18-05 03:44 AM EDT (US)     11 / 29       
    My AI spams Longbow and Cannons now. It used to make lots of hussars.

    It seems AI is more flexable than me. I cannot get away from my love of Muskets.

    Dav0d
    Skirmisher
    posted 09-18-05 08:51 AM EDT (US)     12 / 29       
    I have not noticed anything about the AI learning.
    It always spams out Hussars and some crossbows or longbows(Never changes). And all I have to do is make some pikes in front, and several range units behind. They really get their asses kicked each time. And their fort is built in the same place everytime, and they almost never harass my settlers outside the base.
    Chris27
    Skirmisher
    posted 09-18-05 09:20 AM EDT (US)     13 / 29       
    yes, it is secretly plotting to take over the world...

    the AI can only do as its programmed so It can't "learn" all it can do is follow if __ happens, do this, after __ happens stop and stuff like that.

    Dav0d
    Skirmisher
    posted 09-18-05 09:25 AM EDT (US)     14 / 29       
    Chris27, I think they mean adapting to your unit and build choice. Not learning as a human being... Chill...
    Elpea
    Hal
    (id: lp_usa)
    posted 09-18-05 09:39 AM EDT (US)     15 / 29       
    Here's what it saves:

    Quote:


    <player>Elpea
    <uservars>
    <lastgamedifficulty>3.0000</lastgamedifficulty>
    <myallycount>0.0000</myallycount>
    <myenemycount>1.0000</myenemycount>
    <wasmyallylastgame>0.0000</wasmyallylastgame>
    <lastmapid>-1.0000</lastmapid>
    <mywinlosspercentage>1.0000</mywinlosspercentage>
    </uservars>
    <game>
    <unitcounts>
    <settler>42</settler>
    <pikeman>19</pikeman>
    <musketeer>105</musketeer>
    <mill>2</mill>
    <explorer>1</explorer>
    <tradingpost>4</tradingpost>
    <towncenter>2</towncenter>
    <barracks>3</barracks>
    <stable>1</stable>
    <artillerydepot>1</artillerydepot>
    <rodelero>29</rodelero>
    <culverin>4</culverin>
    <falconet>7</falconet>
    <skirmisher>10</skirmisher>
    <mortar>1</mortar>
    <nathorsearcher>43</nathorsearcher>
    <lancer>14</lancer>
    <wardog>1</wardog>
    <fortfrontier>1</fortfrontier>
    <crateoffood>3</crateoffood>
    <outpost>4</outpost>
    <market>1</market>
    <coveredwagon>1</coveredwagon>
    <cow>3</cow>
    <fortwagon>1</fortwagon>
    <housemed>9</housemed>
    </unitcounts>
    <myteamwon>0</myteamwon>
    <playerrelation>2</playerrelation>
    <firstattacktime>-1</firstattacktime>
    <stattime>2617623
    <score>0</score>
    <villagerefficiency>0.00</villagerefficiency>
    <totalresources>
    <gold>0</gold>
    <wood>0</wood>
    <food>0</food>
    <fame>0</fame>
    <skillpoints>0</skillpoints>
    <xp>0</xp>
    <ships>0</ships>
    </totalresources>
    </stattime>
    </game>


    [This message has been edited by Elpea (edited 09-18-2005 @ 09:43 AM).]

    Dav0d
    Skirmisher
    posted 09-18-05 09:50 AM EDT (US)     16 / 29       
    Yes, but are you sure it uses the information in the Demo ? Because as I sad, I have not noticed any change in the AI.

    Perhaps they need to enhance the AI a bit more in that area ?

    Chris27
    Skirmisher
    posted 09-18-05 10:18 AM EDT (US)     17 / 29       

    Quote:

    Chris27, I think they mean adapting to your unit and build choice. Not learning as a human being... Chill...

    hmmm sry, guess I forgot to put a ""

    CK the Fat
    Skirmisher
    posted 09-18-05 11:13 AM EDT (US)     18 / 29       
    The Spanish build pikemen and rodeleroes to counter my musketeers, but those don't work. So they build musketeers. And lately, they've begun to employ cannons against me. I think it reviews games and tries to figure out your strategies.
    petard_rusher
    Skirmisher
    posted 09-18-05 06:19 PM EDT (US)     19 / 29       
    nope, it doesn't, at least not in the higher level AI
    Doggiedoodle
    Skirmisher
    posted 09-18-05 06:33 PM EDT (US)     20 / 29       
    I haven't noticed that much of a difference as I continue to play it. But sometimes it surprises me and mixes hussars with its longbows which causes some real problems for lancers(giid thing it never makes dragoons). It would be fairly simple for them to make the ai respond to your previous unit choices by increasing the chances of it building a counter for that unit.
    Byzantine2793
    Skirmisher
    posted 09-18-05 06:34 PM EDT (US)     21 / 29       
    but if your spanish vs british on texas it used horse archers
    mike_the_mad
    Skirmisher
    posted 09-18-05 08:24 PM EDT (US)     22 / 29       
    It keeps the information of your last game in profile.xml and adapts to counter your prefered style of play.

    I am LuNatic, Dark lord of the sif
    ~Fear Me Mortals~
    [-GREEM-] Best. Clan. Ever.
    GG2K5
    Skirmisher
    posted 09-18-05 08:29 PM EDT (US)     23 / 29       
    I havn't noticed it learning, 'd be cool if it did though
    petard_rusher
    Skirmisher
    posted 09-18-05 08:58 PM EDT (US)     24 / 29       

    Quoted from mike_the_mad:

    It keeps the information of your last game in profile.xml and adapts to counter your prefered style of play.

    No, it really doesn't. If you want to make this assertion please try to prove it...

    Read l ine 5300-5500 of the AI for a start, inside of the initPersonality function

    [This message has been edited by petard_rusher (edited 09-18-2005 @ 09:07 PM).]

    Cataphract887
    Skirmisher
    posted 09-18-05 09:01 PM EDT (US)     25 / 29       
    it isnt collecting enough data to adapt well enough anyhow,not like a human does.

    i have seen no indication of learning


    "Excellent could be any map that has the quality of a ES random map or ES scenario. AoK is an excellent, award winning game. That's where I'd start." -AnastasiaKafka

    "Hard work is evil. Bitmaps are stupid. Working on a scenario for more than one afternoon is stupid. Triggers are stupid. Testing your own scenario is stupid. The world is stupid. You are the Greatest." -Ingo Van Thiel
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