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Topic Subject: The JOSH
posted 11-22-07 12:45 PM EDT (US)   
yup, another acronym with a J ><

Japanese Onin Sohei Hammer

Welcome back to the newest installment of strategy, a little something I have been testing out in both team games and 1v1s. It is the Sohei allies Rush. Lets have a look:
[JPEG, (152.00 KB)]

11 Sohei Allies
A simple pikemen card it seems, for 500 gold. Too costly? Maybe. If used in the correct way, this card can absolutely shock your opponent. The stats:

Hitpoints: 140
Siege: 38
Attack: 13 (3.5 vs cav, 2.5 vs coyotes)
LOS: 12
Armor: 20% hand resist
Speed: 5
Cost from native: F-55, W-40 (45 gold from card)

These guys have some pretty nice siege. Lets compare that with a samurai:

Hitpoints: 230
Siege: 67
Attack: 25 (1.7 vs cav, 1.5 vs coyotes)
LOS: 16
Armor: 30% hand resist
Speed: 5
Cost: FĖ100 G-100

Those Sohei are 1/4th the cost of samurai, the Japís powerhouse sieger and fighter. Also they train pretty fast (or will with the next part)
The Consulate

This building here gives you several options all to great effect. Iím not too sure on the levels at which they are attainable.

Spain (lvl 40)- Spain is one of my favorite, one of my first choices early game. Why?
  • a slight xp trickle (.8 sec)
  • Merchant marine, which decreases the shipment time in half for all shipments (-50%)
    Ports (lvl 0)- the bonus is a reduction in non-coin building costs (wood and food). This can lead to a faster age up at 640 food as well as a reduction in shrine cost to 108 wood.
  • Besterios are decent xbows for japs
  • Fishing boats for a better economy are always welcome
    Isolation (lvl 0)- one to be reckoned with. Adds 10% attack (in all ways including siege) to your land units. A GREAT passive bonus indeed
  • Batch training in tens is great
  • a military rickshaw grants a stable or rax in need
    Dutch (lvl 20)- a great economic faction, as the coin bonus is appreciated. Probably an afterthought after a failed or pushed back rush.
  • Bank is a great eco bonus
  • Church helps with LOS, Mercantalism, and unit train times
  • excellent military unit (6 stadhouders) even though you already have good musks >
    and there we have it, the consulate options for the Japanese!

    One other item that is used here is the card Onin war, which increases the siege of all your units by a whopping 33%! Think of it as ransack for the Japanese.

    okayÖ that was enough pre rambling, lets get on to the strategy:

    Discovery Age
  • Keep all vills on crates until fully gathered all wood and food. Build a shrine and after that set one villager onto building a consulate.
  • Set explorers to gather every food, gold, wood, and xp treasure you can (I mean all the small ones, and medium ones). Emphasize wood if you donít have enough for a consulate, after that look for gold and food.
  • send your first card, being Good Faith Agreements.

  • Your age up should be with the Shrine, and set around six villagers on it. Age with around ten villagers or less.
    Why? Because the shrine will help your crap economy recover from the fast age up, as well as provide 20 population slots for military. The 200 export is also one of the main reasons for this wonder.

  • while aging gather 500 gold and just enough food (if you can) to keep up constant villager production.
  • be sure to ally with spain, and set the consulate to a hotkey which is easily accessible.
    Colonial Age
  • AS SOON AS YOU AGE UP select your hotkey and click the Merchant Marine (looks like the bottom of a ship going through water) upgrade. DO NOT SEND THE SOHEI YET! Wait until the upgrade is done, or it will have no effect on the shipment!

  • once you finish collecting gold, set half of your villagers on wood and half on food. Youíre looking to get a barracks out and on the field.
  • Your first shipment in colonial should be 11 Sohei

  • With your next shipment, (should be soon, build some shrines or vills to get xp for it) ship Onin War

  • Send your Sohei in to your enemyís TC to start sieging. Ally with isolation to allow your 10% additional siege take effect. Once onin war is in, your Sohei should have 50 siege!. Be carefull of minutemen- if you see them fall back and amass some yumi or ashigaru to compliment your army.
  • If you are rushing a native who has no minutemen or just hasnít called any out, be sure to micro your Sohei. When the town center fires at an unharmed Sohei, select it and put it in cover mode, which will make it last an additional two shots. Continue to do this until the tc is torn down.
  • Next shipment should be economy, like four villagers

    Thatís all I have for now, I hope you enjoyed it! Let me add a couple notes of my findings:

    -This works best on maps that give you a bit of extra crates (obviously) such as deccan. The treasures there are great also.
    - Ill have some recs up as soon as I can, been busy lately
    -This has also worked for me and my buddy in a sling type fashion, to moderate success
    -If used properly, you can take down the tc under six minutes

    well, thanks for reading, now go take down some tcs, Yoi!

    Card order:
    Good Faith Agreements
    11 Sohei
    Onin war

    Proud winner of the FFA Winter Round '07!
    [Judgε][Epic Thread]
    My Vods:[One] [Two][Three][Four]
    "with all the bling on a mandsabar you could win the game by paying the enemy to resign." IL
  • Replies:
    posted 11-22-07 02:44 PM EDT (US)     1 / 12  
    Seems like this strat would work out PERFECTLY on Hispaniola. Just sit back with your bushes and turtle up your economy if the rush fails. (I mean, you opponent will also suffer from bad hunting unless he has CHURAYZEE (crazy) map-control. And what's more, you should have captured enough sheep to "feed" the big shrine, and there's always the sea for further booming. (although I did hear the japs were'nt too good on it.)

    Well written, nice way of using images~ I like it.

    Q: How do I get veteran skirms as the dutch?
    - you have to buy the upgrade in the the barracks lol it should be under the skimiser logo. -you have to be in age3 to get veteran and age 4 to get guard.
    After realizing they get automatically upgraded:
    - o right i play brits so i just guessed.....thats slighly embarrasing lol

    "Ah, the wonderful smell of failure!" - George_III on a full-capslocked topic.
    posted 11-22-07 04:04 PM EDT (US)     2 / 12  
    haha thanks

    while this by no means is a perfect early rush, it cna catch a n FFer off gaurd or assualt the fwd base of an unexpecting foe.

    Proud winner of the FFA Winter Round '07!
    [Judgε][Epic Thread]
    My Vods:[One] [Two][Three][Four]
    "with all the bling on a mandsabar you could win the game by paying the enemy to resign." IL
    posted 11-23-07 01:56 AM EDT (US)     3 / 12  
    Nice strat! Question on the 3rd shipment? Why not press the rush with a second shipment of the Sohei?

    Good strat. Makes me want to hurry up and outline my India Flail/Thugee rush, which also looks to destroy the TC in under 6.
    posted 11-23-07 02:18 AM EDT (US)     4 / 12  
    By the time your second shipment of Sohei have arrived, the opponent will have some Infantry which will destroy your Sohei unless backed by Yumis or Muskets.

    Looks good Cookie, I was tried for a whiel to make use of this, but couldn't quite get it fast enough. What time do you start siegeing?

    Congratulations Serge - Winner of the FFA Spring Series 2008
    posted 11-23-07 04:04 AM EDT (US)     5 / 12  
    By the time your second shipment of Sohei arrive , you should have some Yumi's or Ashigaru to already enforce the first shipment against infantry. The second shipment will make seiging that much quicker. The 4 villi shipment will only serve to reinforce the economy if the rush fails. See my point? In fact, if that rush is to be reinforced, perhaps a 5 Ashigaru shipment should be put in instead? Or perhaps a shipment of calvery to raid the perimeter while you seige, maximizing damage to his eco if the rush fails?

    To me, sending the 4 villies feels like the strat is switching from a rush, into a turtle/boom. In fact, i can't help but feel the 4 shrine shipment would be better all around for this since that would allow a bigger pop, conservation of wood, which would fuel more military units.

    [This message has been edited by Grellen (edited 11-23-2007 @ 04:11 AM).]

    posted 11-23-07 04:36 AM EDT (US)     6 / 12  
    I think this would fail vs. a large majority of civ's openers. However, I think I like it in Jpn mirror..maybe vs. Germany too? How's your success rate vs. humans that are decent CC?
    posted 11-23-07 06:11 AM EDT (US)     7 / 12  
    Iliked it!its about time somebody used the shrine wonder for a strat. i have some doubts though.
    1 ]don't think u will be able to collect 500g and 100f if u task 6 villies to the wonder.2-3 villies i think will be enough.

    2]U could take advantage of the consul;ate early on to ally with ports and age 680 f.this would work great if u had excess food crates.then as soon as u build the wonder switch to spain.and after ur military forces arrive switch to isolation for added damage. as my first shipment i would send 5 ashigurus[vs like spain or germany]or 5 yumis vs dutch skirms,because this will be really susceptible to li with bonus vs hi.i would send military shipment first because i feel that u would be better off asserting military dominance first.sending 11 pikemen alone would be very very risky. if they have some ranged infantry and hit and run u ur gonna get wiped out before ur siege bonus comes into effect.then if u taken out his forces u can use onin or another military shipment.i would use naginatas vs dutch.

    3]if the rush fails i don't see much hope of recovering as ur eco will be on life support.

    these are only my views and overall i would like to say i really enjoyed the strat.great job.
    posted 11-23-07 06:19 AM EDT (US)     8 / 12  
    Err Have you played the Asians at all Xerxes? If you have you'd know that the time required to burn relations is way too long to be switching three times within the time this rush is effective, not to mention you won't have 300 export this early on to do it.

    Proud Citizen of Sovietcanuckistan
    posted 11-23-07 09:21 AM EDT (US)     9 / 12  
    wow! thanks for all the replies guys.

    I'm not gonna lie, this isnt perfect. on Deccan i can get the tc down (without MM) by 5:45 flat. the strat first popped into my mind when i first saw the sohei card in the first place. I took the time to write it up, then realized it turned out to not be what i wanted it to live up to be.

    In the games ive tried this the resources have been scarce, but im working on it. it will take time to look at and adjust the villager amount and things.

    and by all means, send your sohei over while/before onin war is sending. its the icing on the cake

    Proud winner of the FFA Winter Round '07!
    [Judgε][Epic Thread]
    My Vods:[One] [Two][Three][Four]
    "with all the bling on a mandsabar you could win the game by paying the enemy to resign." IL

    [This message has been edited by Cookiecrisp13 (edited 11-23-2007 @ 09:28 AM).]

    posted 11-23-07 12:08 PM EDT (US)     10 / 12  
    Where do you get those images from?

    My grandmother slaps harder than the Agra Fort shoots. And she's dead. ~ Ender_Ward

    By the same token, if I attempt to operate the mouse using nothing but my butt-cheeks, micro will also come down to "luck." ~ Beatnikjoe
    posted 11-24-07 05:28 AM EDT (US)     11 / 12  
    Cool, I could see it being a problem to do agaisnt France but would be fun to do to other civs.

    "Obstacles do not exist to be surrendered to, but only to be broken." - Adolf Hitler

    Proud citizen of Sovietcanuckistan.

    ~92% of teens have moved on to rap. If you are part of the 8% who still listen to real music, copy and paste this into your sig.~
    posted 11-24-07 06:43 AM EDT (US)     12 / 12  
    No,i don't have TAD yet.i played the demo a few times with the asians,i am sorry it was ridiculous of me to comment.thats the reason i haven't posted on any TAD topics before this.
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